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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello everyone,
From the car that keeps on giving!!! The drivers front Electric window has just died so checked the fuse all good but noticed the motor is moving the window up via the switch and clicking but not moving for down.

I cannot change the switch over to test as this switch has a blue connecting block on it and the passenger window on the same door is brown not sure about the passenger side door switch as yet.

Anyhow it is stuck in the up position and I removed the door card to see if anything was seized or jammed but to no avail!!!

Is there another way to test and can the window be freed off manually?
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Tried another switch today and checked the wiring loom in the door post still no joy so going to get a replacement and strip out the old one. Oh Joy!!!
 

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These old cars have simple DC motors working the windows [no fancy built-in electronics]. If the motor is working in one direction, it will work in the other. The only thing that could fail is the gearbox attached to the motor. [The actual mechanism attached to the motor is another issue altogether, just talking about the motor side here..]

Your window motor should have 2 wires going to it. Disconnect the wiring from the motor and supply a [+12v] to one terminal and a [-12v] to the other, the motor should attempt to go in one direction. Reverse the supply to the motor and it should try to go in the other direction. This simple test will tell you if the motor is working or not.

If the motor test shows it is responding to direct power input, your issue of it not wanting to come down will be a wiring/switch/mechanism issue rather than a motor issue.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Many thanks for your advice I did try this earlier and your right so I think the fault is mechanical probably the plastic or cable connectors even thought the motor does look a little rusty Once I get the new part I will update. I believe there is a cable repair kit for these cars but not sure what they include.
 

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and supply a [+12v] to one terminal and a [-12v] to the other
+12 to -12 equates to 24 volts.

General convention states that the + side of a 12v battery is +12v and the - side is 0 volts (or ground / earth in automotive terms).

Would have been more accurate to state 'apply the positive side of the battery to one termonal and the negative side to the other'. I realise this is what you meant but some people would take the original statement as it actually reads and feed 24 volts into a 12 volt motor.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
+12 to -12 equates to 24 volts.

General convention states that the + side of a 12v battery is +12v and the - side is 0 volts (or ground / earth in automotive terms).

Would have been more accurate to state 'apply the positive side of the battery to one termonal and the negative side to the other'. I realise this is what you meant but some people would take the original statement as it actually reads and feed 24 volts into a 12 volt motor.
A very valid point as stupidity knows no bounds LOL !! and I include myself in that category as it can be very easy to overlook things.
such as termonal and terminal but anyone who takes the time to help others I always admire and respect,
 

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The 405 did have 1 touch windows and electronics to control them on some models so it may still be the wiring/control box.

If your switch you mention with blue plug has 4 buttons rather than just a simple rocker like the rest it is a 1 touch system and the control boxes were prone to failure but it could also be the magnets fell off inside motor case that happened a lot too
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
The 405 did have 1 touch windows and electronics to control them on some models so it may still be the wiring/control box.

If your switch you mention with blue plug has 4 buttons rather than just a simple rocker like the rest it is a 1 touch system and the control boxes were prone to failure but it could also be the magnets fell off inside motor case that happened a lot too
Thank you for that as it is the blue plug that has failed and I did noticed that the one touch operation has not been working for a while. I will add photos once I have got the new part and compare them. Although I think just having the window opening and closing would be good enough for the moment
 

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I might have a working control box somewhere as i fitted 1 from a 405 to my 505 at 1 point and the wiring ended up in the loft long story :)
 

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Not being picky - just trying to be accurate. I'm a great believer in 'Say what you mean & mean what you say' and I know some people who have little electrical knowledge who take things as they read them and if that was an answer to a question they had asked would indeed have tried to put 24 volts into a 12 volt system.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Pug 405 Electric Window

Just a quick update as I finally received a new electric window regulator as I did try testing the old one first by attaching a 12 volt supply to it and even reversing the supply to see if it would move but got nothing,

Which is weird, as when I plugged it back into the modulator box you could still see the window wanting to move upwards?

Anyway I removed the old one and fitted the new one plugged it and yep you guessed it, still goes up but won’t come down so maybe it’s as some of you have you said already on here that the problem is the modulator box.

I have attached some photos on here of the old and new parts and as you can see the old was a bit worn LOL. You can also see me testing the old motor direct to battery. I have power in both directions but nothing moving. Not even a whirr from the motor

Unless anyone knows different is there any extra fuses or relays I should check as well as I followed the Haynes and I only found the one controlling fuse for electric windows and sunroof which is fine.
 

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Hi Riber3,

As you know I had some 405s over the years and I do remember I had a similar issue as you. Check the vertical runners the glass slides in, iin the door. These have been spot welded in at the factory and over the years the welds corrode and brake.If this has happened to yours, one runner out of line will make the glass out of line. Worth a look I reckon..

Grumpy
 

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Try reversing the wiring at the motor and press the up button if it then goes down the control unit is most likely the culprit i will have a look for mine im sure it is still floating around somewhere.

Failing that the wiring can be altered to make it a normal switch again IE no 1 touch system
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Hi Riber3,

As you know I had some 405s over the years and I do remember I had a similar issue as you. Check the vertical runners the glass slides in, iin the door. These have been spot welded in at the factory and over the years the welds corrode and brake.If this has happened to yours, one runner out of line will make the glass out of line. Worth a look I reckon..

Grumpy
Thanks for the advice I have checked the runners, cleaned and greased. Seems the problem is definitely the modulator box or the window motor.

I have managed to get continuity on the window motor via connecting it up to a battery to test but its not going up or down so not sure if I need to run a separate earth to the frame as its not moving. Not even when I reverse the wires!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Managed to get my hands on another bitronic control box and Hey Presto all working. Not sure if the old one is repairable but may have a go and take it apart at the weekend
 
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