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Discussion Starter #1
Hello, I am new to this forum.
I own a 2007 model 207 HDI sports 1.6 90BHP
Needless to say my turbo has gone after owning the car for 5 months.
The previous owner had a new turbo fitted from a garage just before I got it.
When I picked it up I fully serviced the car with the best of stuff as I thought it was worth it. Since then I have done 4000 miles and yesterday the turbo went on me throwing lots of smoke out the exhaust.
_______Please bear with me on the next bit as I have no money to buy a new turbo or a new engine__________
SO I have done the following as a temp fix until I get sorted out.
Removed the cassette and removed the bent shaft and fans.
Placed a bolt through it with copper washers either side.
blocked the oil inlet with nut and bolt with copper washers again and blocked the return back to the sump.
In short making the car non turbo.
Changed oil / filter and placed a blank plate behind the EGR.
The car drives normally aspirated OK, can achieve 60 / 70 mph still on the flat but on a hill I am lucky to get 30 to 35 mph, but for now I travel short trips and speed limits do not let me go above these speeds so that's OK for now.
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I do when I accelerate hard or climb a hill with big revs get a dash fault
"Depollution system faulty" and an engine management light on that does not affect the drive speed. When I plug a reader in it finds a fault, P0402 Exhaust gas re-circulation flow excessive detected. This code can be erased by my reader and will not come back until I drive it hard.
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That's my dilemma at this time.!!!
By doing what I have done am I asking for trouble with other things to break or if I can live with the non turbo for now will it be OK.
I have read putting another turbo on it will only last a few thousand mile and die again so remove the turbo and block the egr might help for now ??
As far as the fault codes go and what brings them on what do you think will be a fix ?
Am I thinking this is a good plan of action a good idea, as I have no money to get a fix or an engine for now ? Or will I incur another problem with the course of action I have taken to keep my transport.
Thanks in advance for any tech advice on this mod I have had to do.
:confused:
 

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The turbo has likely to have failed as the oil feed filter gets blocked from oil that isnt changed early enough or is the wrong grade, starving the turbo of oil. Just putting a new turbo on is likely to fail again. The oil feed needs to be changed too to prevent it happening again and preferably clean the sump too. You can buy a new cartridge and replace that fairly cheap on the internet if the internals of the turbo are not too damaged.

You aren't really causing any damage as you are running now.

The egr fault is probably the valve sticking. Take it out & clean it with wd40 and fit the blanking plate and you will probably not see the fault for it anymore
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Was going to remove the inter cooler today but the weather was a bit naff to be standing out working in the rain.
I think to remove the intercooler I will have to remove the front panel ??
If there is an easy way to take them off please let me know.
I also believe that the oil capacity and the oil pump pressure is too low in these engines.
Bigger sump that takes more oil would help.
They are running that hot the small amount of oil is not getting a chance to cool and its been circulated around still very hot.
Just my thoughts.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I have been told from Peugeot and another independent garage that the engine is finished.
Please bear with me on this one but I can not really see how this is.
I have ran it for a week or so non turbo and the engine sounds well, drives well, does not overheat with water or oil, so how on earth can the engine be finished.
I have bought a turbo cartridge, oil, filter and gasket sealant to begin the job.
Another thing is some said to me you MUST replace the oil feed pipe to the turbo, well I have removed it and removed the silly gauze filter from the bango and its clean as a whistle so why would the pipe need to be replaced as in my eyes it is as good as new.
Also the oil strainer in the sump can be removed and thoroughly cleaned so why is there a need for a replacement unit.
Are some people making some owners of these cars spend unnecessary money to but things that can easily be cleaned and re used.
Peugeot are fully aware of this problem with these engines but refuse to admit they should be on recall and always blame the owner for incorrect oil or not servicing at right times.
This car has always been serviced ( oil / filter ) at max of 6000 miles with the correct grade of oil. I will say what I think ..
The oil capacity is too small and these engines run hot so the oil never gets a chance to cool as it has no rest in the sump. The oil is breaking down due to temperatures .
If the sump held another 1L of oil it would help dramatically.
The injector bolts work loose and should be re tightened about every 5000, yet another poor design.
This is a worldwide problem with these engines and are fitted in many makes of cars.
Someone needs to hold their hands up and say sorry all the problems are design related and will be recalled and a permanent cure will be given to owners.
 

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I have been told from Peugeot and another independent garage that the engine is finished.
Please bear with me on this one but I can not really see how this is.
I have ran it for a week or so non turbo and the engine sounds well, drives well, does not overheat with water or oil, so how on earth can the engine be finished.
I have bought a turbo cartridge, oil, filter and gasket sealant to begin the job.
Another thing is some said to me you MUST replace the oil feed pipe to the turbo, well I have removed it and removed the silly gauze filter from the bango and its clean as a whistle so why would the pipe need to be replaced as in my eyes it is as good as new.
Also the oil strainer in the sump can be removed and thoroughly cleaned so why is there a need for a replacement unit.
Are some people making some owners of these cars spend unnecessary money to but things that can easily be cleaned and re used.
Peugeot are fully aware of this problem with these engines but refuse to admit they should be on recall and always blame the owner for incorrect oil or not servicing at right times.
This car has always been serviced ( oil / filter ) at max of 6000 miles with the correct grade of oil. I will say what I think ..
The oil capacity is too small and these engines run hot so the oil never gets a chance to cool as it has no rest in the sump. The oil is breaking down due to temperatures .
If the sump held another 1L of oil it would help dramatically.
The injector bolts work loose and should be re tightened about every 5000, yet another poor design.
This is a worldwide problem with these engines and are fitted in many makes of cars.
Someone needs to hold their hands up and say sorry all the problems are design related and will be recalled and a permanent cure will be given to owners.


Hi, in Norway we can get a bigger sump pan it takes 4L oil and its made by a company called Klokkarholm in Sweden i know its for sale in Denmark to.
The bigger sump also got the oil tapping screw facing outward so you can get all the oil out of the pan.
Here is a link they cost around 80£ here so they are cheaper then the oem, im going to change after i have changed my turbo.
I dont know if they are for sale in the UK but you can check ebay.

Link: MECA Online Norge
 

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I have been told from Peugeot and another independent garage that the engine is finished.
Please bear with me on this one but I can not really see how this is.
I have ran it for a week or so non turbo and the engine sounds well, drives well, does not overheat with water or oil, so how on earth can the engine be finished.
I have bought a turbo cartridge, oil, filter and gasket sealant to begin the job.
Another thing is some said to me you MUST replace the oil feed pipe to the turbo, well I have removed it and removed the silly gauze filter from the bango and its clean as a whistle so why would the pipe need to be replaced as in my eyes it is as good as new.
Also the oil strainer in the sump can be removed and thoroughly cleaned so why is there a need for a replacement unit.
Are some people making some owners of these cars spend unnecessary money to but things that can easily be cleaned and re used.
Peugeot are fully aware of this problem with these engines but refuse to admit they should be on recall and always blame the owner for incorrect oil or not servicing at right times.
This car has always been serviced ( oil / filter ) at max of 6000 miles with the correct grade of oil. I will say what I think ..
The oil capacity is too small and these engines run hot so the oil never gets a chance to cool as it has no rest in the sump. The oil is breaking down due to temperatures .
If the sump held another 1L of oil it would help dramatically.
The injector bolts work loose and should be re tightened about every 5000, yet another poor design.
This is a worldwide problem with these engines and are fitted in many makes of cars.
Someone needs to hold their hands up and say sorry all the problems are design related and will be recalled and a permanent cure will be given to owners.
They're wrong that the engine is finished, only the turbo. Yiy can remove the filter and clean the pipe rather than use a new one but you can't guarantee it is completely clean, hence why the service bulletin states it needs to be replaced (possibly the new ones are a different design?) If you are removing the gauze you are still taking the risk that larger particles will be drawn through the pipe and get into the turbo bearings. ensure you check the flow through the pipe before connecting to the turbo.

The oil strainer and sump and assembly does not need t be replaced just cleaned. The issue is not present in all engines, but generally occurs on those which have used the incorrect oil (5w30 c2) or have been services irregularly. The oil capacity isn't the issue here it is carbon build up (usual on a diesel) being accentuated by the wrong oil grade and leaving it there too long, letting it cool longer won't stop the oil picking up the carbon deposits
 

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The poster above also makes a good point about the sump plug modification is it traps some of the sludge from being drained, though I normally just drop a but of fresh oil in with the plug undone until it drains out clean underneath
 

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Discussion Starter #9
The poster above also makes a good point about the sump plug modification is it traps some of the sludge from being drained, though I normally just drop a but of fresh oil in with the plug undone until it drains out clean underneath
Is the reason why that the oil makes carbon is that because of the heat due to not enough oil been circulated, the oil never gets a chance to cool so it literally boils creating carbon deposit.
Oil ran it these temperatures loosed all its lubrication and the oil will become no better than water eventually.
I might be wrong but thats my thoughts.
 

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I had my sump down before the summer vacation and i pressed the sump plug down in a press, i have changed oil on many of the 1.6hdi and the oil is always thin on the 2,0hdi 136bhp there is often alot of diesel in the oil but thats not the case with the 1.6hdi.
I think heat is a big factor on the oil, i only use mobil1 esp 5W-30 or the castrol oil (dont remeber what its called now) but good oil is important.

Last month i was in a traning course through my work it was held by mobil1, he told us that the esp oils is a very special oil and the most complex oil at the market today.
He also showed us what the different oils look like after they have been subjected to high heat, the cheap oils and half synthetic oils burn and leave a burnt layer on the surface and dirt will then stick to this surface.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Possibly partly, more as a result of combustion, blow by, the crankcase breather, and egr
It does not help that the injector bolts loosen and need a nip about every 5000 miles or so, personally I can not see the point of an engine breathing its own crap so blanking them off has to be a help to a so called dirty engine.
I will begin work on this in the morning and see what the strip reveals as to why the oil becomes useless and makes carbon.
As to the oil side of things I will use 5w 40 ( C2 low ash ) as opposed to 5w 30,
I will keep my old cartridge that I have adapted to make one of these non turbo as well incase this turbo chucks it quickly.
Its a 20 min job to put a cartridge in so it might be handy to carry as a spare so the car is derivable in the event a turbo goes.
Well we will see what tomorrow brings when I begin.
 

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With the issues that you have had, I would be using 5w30 not 5w40, wouldn't be surprised if the thicker oil has been the cause of your issue with the turbo tbh, as the oil is thicker when warm = less flow, not ideal when the turbo is spinning at 25000 rpm, but if you know better than me go for it. Cant say my injector bolts have ever been loose though.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
With the issues that you have had, I would be using 5w30 not 5w40, wouldn't be surprised if the thicker oil has been the cause of your issue with the turbo tbh, as the oil is thicker when warm = less flow, not ideal when the turbo is spinning at 25000 rpm, but if you know better than me go for it. Cant say my injector bolts have ever been loose though.
I have ran 5w 30 for the last two changes, one 5000 miles ago and one 120 miles ago, I was under the impression that when the oil gets to the temperature it does it looses velocity and the 40 grade would actually help matters and still falls within Peugeot guide lines on the oil.
I was seriously thinking of adding some slick 50 but have decided against it for now to see how this goes incase the slick bakes, I am not sure if it does but I will begin my homework on slick to see what temperatures makes that solidify or turn to carbon.
I will no doubt keep info coming on how this goes.
I am not building my hopes up as I personally know people who is on turbo number 4 and they are good fitters, Simple case should be Peugeot should recall this and recognize it as a major fault like it is.
 

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Discussion Starter #15 (Edited)
Done the repair !
After the normal 3 times engine flush but flushed as non turbo to clean things down here is the crack.
Removed oil / filter / sump / oil feed pipe / return pipe / fuel injector seals / vacuum pipes / all breather pipes / mas air flow / cat and then began to see what was happening in there. ( Clean all sensors with brake cleaner ).
Well on my engine the oil was not ridiculously sludge it did however have particles in the bottom of the sump that I mistaken for metal particles to the touch that turned out to be carbon deposit on second inspection.
The main oil filter was "CLED" literally could dig heaps of carbon from filter fins and non was attracted to a magnet so its all carbon crap once again.
This is after a recent oil / filter change ...so yes these are a dirty engine.
The silly filter in the turbo oil feed pipe that is located on the block behind the cat was not even blocked or little or and crap was in it.
After removing the cat front pipe you will wonder why on earth are the bolts that hold this on where they are !!!! Silly really.
So anyways, remove that oil feed filter and sling it, clean the pipe with fluid, I used kerosene and diesel mix through a pressure wash bath and got it immaculate, do this with the sump and turbo oil return pipe as well.
When the sump is off fix the oil return pipe from the turbo and blow through it to check for restrictions, on mine there was none.
Remove the oil pickup from the bottom of the block that goes in the sump..TX bolts X 3..Clean this out mine had not a lot but a bit carbon crap in it that felt like grit to the touch.
Clean the block face where the sump fits and the sump face and you need to apply sealant gasket ( The stuff ford use to bond sumps on is cheapest ) about £6 for a tube that fits a mastic gun.
Begin your rebuild. Clean everything and I mean clean it. :nod:
fit the new turbo cartridge ( Yes you only need a cartridge ) never mind what the so called know it all say ( The rest of the turbo is cosmetic and literally its "clothes" that do nothing, as long as its not too bad clean it and tidy it up and re use it.. prime it with clean oil fill the levels, check it puts about 0.3 of a liter OR MORE within 60 seconds of running back out through the turbo outlet, ( Mine threw 500ml in 30.1 seconds timed on my phone )
Filled oil to level and ran for 15 mins ( driving ) brought back and removed the main oil filter again. Not too bad but a few bits of gritty carbon was there.
New filter fitted. Ran for another 45 mins normal driving.
Removed filter and was quite clean this time.
Dropped oil, was not too bad, And removed filter.
New oil + filter 5w 40 grade C2 spec low ash. Now the car runs as it should and I am happy with it.
My car runs great now ! And I have instantly put this car up for sale as do not kid your self that you are going to own the one that nothing goes wrong, they are designed a piece of crap ! temp and oil capacity has a great part on the downfall of this engine.
I refer to one of the other posts I made on this thread and a comment I made,
( The oil capacity is too small and these engines run hot so the oil never gets a chance to cool as it has no rest in the sump. The oil is breaking down due to temperatures .) This is a key to why these engines fail.
My conclusion is like I said when I began this post..
Bad design and manufactures will not admit failure as they are always trying to keep up to the stupid EU regulations that by the way does not work.
Well to conclude this, my car running fine now is for sale and I will be buying another car (PRE all silly EU stuff ) that I can work on and get bits for.
Pay a bit more road tax...Phew good, saves me doing a turbo 12 teen times a year on these pieces of turd..LOL
Thanks See / Speak later.
Steve

PS: maybe not typed in exact sequence but I hope you get the jist of how things are / went.
I really stand by my signature ....these are horrible engines that should have a recall on them.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Well what do I say ? "Not good with words."
These engines are a piece of crap, they should be problem free as supposedly they are made to EU spec that will impress the user and last long term to help the environment.
Well sometimes I am too old school, I get told "you can not do this and this will not work" but I have to try.
I believe the country has forgot simple mechanics and now relay on a "You can't do that Society" That talks sh1t ! Sorry its what they have been told.
Look my thoughts are.........
I believe if we could increase the sump size and increase the oil volume that would be a start.
Run the oil at a lower temp...hence introduce some oil cooler either air or water.
So sorry but its like that....not enough oil and not enough cool temps.
I reckon I could make these engines run cooler with modifications so why on earth does the manufactures not think that is possible ?
They tell you the engine is dead so you have to buy another...they do !
Tell you why..
Cos WE as owners think ...I can not say nothing as I am only an owner and all I will be told is shut up or baffled with customer relations shit so whats the point ?
The point is this.
We as owners of this engine we now own was sold as a working item, when it was sold to us it did not or never come with a lifespan ( did it ?)
So if this is a problem that by the way is world wide why is it not recognized by any dealers and you get fooked off ?
See my point ? They do not work and are not fit for purpose/
I have worked on engines for over 30 years and know what works and does not so why has this situation arose ? ANSWER the manufacturer failed to supply goods suitable for everyday use that has placed a time scale on it.
More or less saying " Buy this and then its fucked after a while " unless you trade it in piss off as old cars ! We do not do them.
UNLESS they sell us disposable engines nowadays that have a life expectancy ? Well sorry I never bought a car under there terms .
No one did ! Otherwise classic cars would not exist .
Sorry to rant on about this but come on ...
You all know the 1.6HDI is a disposable engine due to the EU sh1t they have to work by.
Well that's no good to me.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
You should buy a bicycle, we won't have to listen to you winging then.
Joe I thought this was a Peugeot forum to discuss and share opinions and problems ???
To help people and stuff like that .
All you know is what is printed on the bulletin that you have read and more than likely never done your self.
If you do not want to read this you can unsubscribe from this thread mate, its really that simple.
 

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These engines are rubbish but its not really the engines fault its stupid eu emission regs that cause the designers to make small engines that are meant to be cleaner and fit turbos to make enough power its never going to work long term

They do need more oil they do need a better sump design but these 2 things would not stop the failures as the turbo is too small and is overworked constantly.

older diesels making less power had BIGGER turbos and they rarely failed.
 
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