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Discussion Starter #1
Hi again guys

After a nice period with rather hot winter climate (0 - 6 deg C) the cold is now getting here.

It's been around -5 to -15 deg outside lately, and my car is really bad to start.

Even this morning with only -6 deg it was not easy, had to try a couple of times and it starts and rattles a lot.

Last weekend it was -13 deg and I could not get it to start at all, had to run the webasto engine heater for 20 minutes before it would start.

I have no fault codes on it, new glow plug relay and 4 new plugs last year.

I would suppose it would throw a fault code if it could not get enough fuel pressure?

It is just my injectors that's so crappy it won't start?

Found this movie on youtube, and this is more or less how my car was at -13 deg. I didn't try as long as this guy though, as I was afraid of emptying the battery.


Any ideas?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yes might try this weekend if the cold is still there.

The day it wouldn't start without heating the coolant water first my good old 405 2.1 TD started quite easy (for that sort of temperatures), so something must surely be off.

Is there a way of logging the parameters, or do I just need to keep an eye on the fuel pressure parameters etc. in the live view and try to remember it?
 

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I imagine you always have winter grade diesel at your pumps ? Or could the fuel be poor.

I know in the UK we can't get it in the summer months (at work we can only refill our emergency Diesel engine fuel tanks in the winter when winter grad is available).
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Surely winter grade, it gets -30C sometimes, well not this year, but almost -20 has been several nights.

So it can't be the diesel. As I said my old 405 TD started quite easy in -17 deg with the same diesel...

Charging my laptop now, so need to hook up PP2000 someday when it's stood and gotten completely cold.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I've hooked it up on diagnostics.

Glow plugs found in good nick and also no fault on the relay, so surely it must be something else.

Tried to make a small vid when starting today of the live data, but quality suffered once uploaded to photobucket.

http://s428.photobucket.com/user/B1ackMi16/media/407/CAM00250_zps08abc063.mp4.html

However might it be that I have a "slow" reacting fuel pressure regulator?
Today even after initial startup and running for some minutes, I stopped it and would start it again and it died just after startup. Then started fine again.

It's not easy to see on the vid at all, but I thought maybe that the pressure in the beginning of the cranking period was about 250 bars for a little while before reaching about 300 and it would fire up.

I remember also after I had the engine out and lots of air in the hoses, I cranked a lot and it wouldn't start at all (starter stops spinning after engine has hit a certain RPM I think?). Anyway when cranking it in gear it didn't hit this same RPM limit so it would crank for a much longer time. And suddenly it managed to get the fuel pressure right and fire up. Initially I thought this was a one off problem due to the air etc. and pressure regulator probably working outside its normal limits. However it could possibly indicate a slow reacting regulator?

I guess it also could be injectors somehow, but I would have thought it should start even with 1 or 2 bad ones, and I don't really believe it's got 4 bad injectors. I did test the return flow of them 1 year ago and they were quite similar all 4.

Anyone got experience with typical fuel pressure regulator issues?
 

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Have you tried turning the ignition on leaving the ignition on until the glowplug light goes out several times consecutively before trying to start the engine just to try and get a bit more heat in the cylinders ?

I had a Hyundai that didn't like below freezing temperatures and doing the above made a big difference.
 

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When my wife's 307 had trouble cold starting I replaced the battery. I tested it beforehand and it checked out ok with a drop tester, and it seemed to be spinning over plenty fast enough.
A new battery cured this completely, now the engine springs into life almost instantly in the coldest weather - nothing like -16 though:)!.

Roger.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I haven't tried so much more actually, temps have been generally higher, so not had problems lately.

Not tried to bump start it, can't be bothered about that in the morning :)

I have tried to let the glow plug light go out several times before starting, but it does not seem to affect the starting performance.

I could try to use a better battery next winter to see if that cures it, but I don't think it cranks over that slowly really.
 

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I could try to use a better battery next winter to see if that cures it, but I don't think it cranks over that slowly really.
That's what I thought about my wifes car, but a new battery fixed it. If I remember correctly from my classroom days an indirect injection diesel needs to crank at 150+ rpm to start promptly.

Roger.
 

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i have the same problem with cold start, i checked the injectors on the bench, replaced glow plugs/relay and the starter motor and still is making problems starting from cold folowed by a rattling sound and smoke . When is warm starts perfect no smoke no rattle.
Any ideeas?
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I think if there is just a general starting problem it might be cranking speed or fuel pressure related. But on mine, where just 1 or 2 cylinders are knocking, I believe it's more likely to be an injector issue.

I've never bothered to do anything about it, doesn't use the car as often anymore, but did start in -15C the other day, it required like 10 attempts, and need to be started with throttle pedal to the floor... and knocks and smokes badly in the beginning.
 

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well when I started it during the day it did showed water in fuel filter and it did spit a good amount of fuel on the underbonnet.

I am suspecting one or 2 injectors not being in great shape, but it could be just bad diesel, or kind of normal?

Here are:
-10 2 dead glow plugs
-19 12 months old Bosch glow plugs, no errors on lexia for GP relay

well it starts decently. And this was without repeating glow plugs, just straight key in, wait for GP indicator to shut down, and then crank (also battery is probably 5+ yo)
I just dislike that knocking sound for first 10-40sec, it makes me twitch
 
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